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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #1 
Hi:
I bought a Pfaff 362 last summer. I downloaded the manual and service manual. I was referred to a local 81 yo retired Pfaff trained repairman and former SM store owner for help to refurbish her. He charged me a lot. When I picked up the SM, he did a quick demo for me and I left. I really wanted to understand how to use the "stitch wheel" to make the wonderful decorative stitches. He did let me take pictures of his stitch wheel. I got home and tried to duplicate what he showed me. I was unsuccessful even when using the manual for a guide. I went back to him for help. He was very rude...did a quick demo again. But refused to answer any more of my questions stating he was too busy. He made it sound like there was a certain order in maneuvering the dials/levers in order to get decorative stitches.
Since that time I have used the machine for SS and ZZ and love the machine.

Recently, I re- oiled and cleaned the machine hoping that would solve my problem. I am still unsuccessful getting the decorative stitches to be produced. No matter how I finagle the dials and levers I just get a SS.

I have been searching the internet but have not found any info about Pfaff 362 model. The Pfaff vintage group also really did not come to my rescue.
I was hoping some one here would be kind enough to give me some suggestions or point me in the right direction to be able to get my Paff 362 to sew decorative stitches.

Thanks
Kathy
Near the IL/WI border

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KenmoreGal2

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Reply with quote  #2 
I googled "Pfaff 362" and got a thread on the QB.

http://www.quiltingboard.com/vintage-antique-machine-enthusiasts-f22/vintage-sewing-machine-shop-come-sit-spell-t43881-3647.html

There's a post by "Candace" who has the same machine. I clicked on her profile and she's still active. In fact she was on the site today. Perhaps you could send her a PM through QB and she could help you.

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Miriam

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Reply with quote  #3 
Candace is registered here, too. She might know an active group where you might find more info if she doesn't have time to help.
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KenmoreGal2

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Reply with quote  #4 
Great! I didn't think to look for her here too Miriam. Thanks!
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PatriciaPf

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Reply with quote  #5 
I have a 360 and a stitch wheel so perhaps I can help you.  If the cam system on the 362 was markedly changed, this might not work.

A working stitch wheel is a necessity for determining the settings for each decorative stitch.  Each one is different, so each setting on the stitch wheel/machine is different.  

1.  Decide the length of the motif you wish to sew, i.e., short to long, and set dial E between 1 and 7.  If left on 0 (zero) all is disengaged.
2.  Set the stitch length of dial G, depending on how close together you want the stitches. 1.5 is a good start.
3.  To sew diamonds, for example, SET:
          Dial A=0
                 B= straight down (moves the needle left, right or center, and changes the motif)
          Dial C=4
          Dial D=3 (under the pivoting lid on top)
4.  Begin sewing, and make stitch length adjustments as needed.  

Try this one motif and let me know what happens.  I hope it works.  [smile] 

Edit:  I took a look at the 362 manual and the instructions are identical to the 360.  It this doesn't work, it is possible that the mechanism is stuck.  I sprayed my machines' innards with PB Blaster and heated it with a hairdryer until the ZZ loosened up and would function normally.  It's been fine ever since. 

Patty


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Patty
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Miriam

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Reply with quote  #6 
Kathy was cooking when I was looking at that machine. All I did was set the tensions so it made a nice stitch. She forgot to ask me how to do decorative stitches... I would have had to check the manual. It is a wonderful machine. I should have played with it more the next day. We hopped from one machine to another.
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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #7 
Patty:
Thanks for your guidance.
The "stitch wheel" I have works the same for 260/262 360/362 and 368 models. Therefore your steps and number would be the same on my 362. Sadly, my machine continued doing a SS.
Per, Candace's QB post, and following her suggestion, I guess I have to take my cam stack off and do some internal cleaning. I think I will first try to get inbetwwen the metal stacks with some naphtha that Miriam taught me. And use some heat and then reoil the machine. And hope this solves my problem. If not then I will have to go to a professional repair person.
Thanks,
Kathy
Near WI/IL border

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PatriciaPf

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Reply with quote  #8 
Should you get the machine to do what it should, please let us know what you did. "Forewarned is forearmed!"
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Patty
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Miriam

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Reply with quote  #9 
Naphtha is flammable so be careful with heat. Just bring it over next week and we can mess with it. We need a repair manual.
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phansen

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Reply with quote  #10 
There is the oldpfaffforum on yahoo groups. Only thing I will say about it is takes forever to join, posts take up to a week to show and the actual knowledge of the members in my experience is limited. They do have a service manual for 260 and 360. Not sure if these would be close enough to help.
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phansen

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Reply with quote  #11 
Here's the service manual I mentioned.

manual in 3 parts.

pdf Pfaff 260-360 Service Manual1.pdf     


pdf Pfaff 260-360 Service Manual2.pdf     


pdf Pfaff 260-360 Service Manual3.pdf     


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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #12 
Hi Peter:
I am a member of the yahoo Pfaff group. I have downloaded the 360 manual and 360 service manual from the site. I did not really get an answer to my inquiry at their forum .
I have appreciated the replies here. I am slowly trying to follow them. However, I am worried that my fix is beyond my capabilities.
Thanks,
Kathy
Near the WI/IL border

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Patricktweed

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Reply with quote  #13 
I have the same problem when my 362 sits for a long period of time without being used. After lubricating the machine, I have to set it to the stitch I want and run the machine for a few minutes before it will start the fancy stitch I select. It always eventually works.
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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #14 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patricktweed
I have the same problem when my 362 sits for a long period of time without being used. After lubricating the machine, I have to set it to the stitch I want and run the machine for a few minutes before it will start the fancy stitch I select. It always eventually works.


Hi Peter:

Is there a specific order of how you set you stitch dial & levers to get the stitch you want? Would you please state for me an example of which dials/levers you manipulate in order achieve a specific stitch to have your machine sew.

I am curious about this because, you reminded me ( I forgot till now) that last year the grumpy retire Pfaff repair man mentioning something "order" to get the machine to stitch. ( before he rudely dismissed me).

Thanks,
Kathy
Near the Wi/IL border

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phansen

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Reply with quote  #15 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChattyKathy
Hi Peter: Is there a specific order of how you set you stitch dial & levers to get the stitch you want? Would you please state for me an example of which dials/levers you manipulate in order achieve a specific stitch to have your machine sew. I am curious about this because, you reminded me ( I forgot till now) that last year the grumpy retire Pfaff repair man mentioning something "order" to get the machine to stitch. ( before he rudely dismissed me). Thanks, Kathy Near the Wi/IL border



I think you meant patrick ?? [smile]


Anyhow I would use some triflow spray. Set the machine in different positions. Up, down, on its back, on its front and give the mechanism a spray. Let it sit for a few hours change position respray with the triflow. It will work its way in and free up the mechanism. Just watch that timing belt. Don't get oil on it.


Found a nice video covering you machines issue.

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phansen

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Reply with quote  #16 
Here is a printable pattern wheel. It may or may not work for your machine.

Side 1 with center.jpg  Side 2 with center.jpg 

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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #17 
Oops sorry about the name mix up.

I do very much appreciate everyone's help.

I had seen this video. I am very much intimidated by the thought of removing the stitching mechanism. I also, do not think I have the correct tools to do the job. I will clean with naphtha and continue to lubricate my machine thoroughly and attempt stitching with it to hope that it it will "kick in".

Thanks,

Kathy

Near WI/IL border

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phansen

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Reply with quote  #18 
Kathy your signature says IL/WI border how far are you from Crystal Lake Il?
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Candace

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Reply with quote  #19 
Are you the person who messaged me on the QB?  I responded to your questions and you may want to cheek your messages. Pretty much Pfaffs were sprayed with an chemical to prevent rust on the trip to the US markets.   This chemical tends to lock machines up tight and the only way to get them freely moving again is to remove the embroidery unit and clean and lubricate the dickens out of it.  If you don't feel comfortable doing that you need to find a repair person versed in vintage Pfaffs.
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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #20 
Hi Candace,
Yes, I was bugging you. Thanks kindly for your thorough advice. I will do my best alone and with help from my VSS friends. If we still have no luck then hopefully I can find a kind repairman.

I am impressed with how beautiful my Pfaff 362 looks. The SS and ZZ stitch are one of the best I have seen. Unfortunately my decorative stitches are not showing. That chemical spray really kept the rust away for about 60 years now. Guess they did not know that later it would cause the machine to have freeze/sticky problems.

Kathy
Near the WI/IL border

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TwassG

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Reply with quote  #21 

Cathy,
the sticky automatic is a well known issue with these Pfaffs. Apart from the broken capacitors it's the most common problem on german boards, I think.

I would use some Try-Flow, Wd40, Kerosin whatever you have at hand on the automatic, let it sit some hours and then heat it with a hairdryer - but careful. After that, let the machine run some minutes and oil it good. If it's still not working properly repeat it.

Can you move the needleposition? I bet that doesn't work!

Good luck!






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Patricktweed

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Reply with quote  #22 
I don't think I had to set the dials in any sequence. I just had to oil it and let it run before the internal cams would start to control the stitches.

If you need the stitch wheel a reproduction can be purchased through http://www.tias.com/173/PictPage/1923120708.html.
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Ollie9548

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Reply with quote  #23 
I have a Pfaff 362.  I did not have to set the dials in a particular order to obtain an embroidery stitch.  When I got mine the zig zag and embroidery were completely seized.  I took it to a repairman and he half-fixed it (when I got it back the dials were still stiff and needle position was screwy, bobbin winder didn't work and stop-matic didn't either).  My husband and I fiddled with it and got the bobbin winder working (bent in shipping, no doubt) and stop-matic adjusted so it works (this is an early needle-up function).  I used Bluecreeper and sewing machine oil to loosen it up more (Bluecreeper is a penetrant; PB Blaster is more readily available and also works well on stuck parts), so now the zig zag and needle position knobs work.  We spent several hours adjusting the needle position (this is not for the faint of heart, it still isn't quite right but is better than it was before; my husband had to get a machinist friend to modify a cheap wrench to do the job, regular ones are too thick to get into the narrow space).  I haven't been brave enough to try the embroidery stitches since we worked on the needle position, but I tried it before.  Removing the embroidery unit isn't terribly difficult, it only takes a screwdriver and maybe some needle-nosed pliers (2 or 3 screws, a spring, 3 springy levers, and a bowden cable guide if I remember correctly).  It comes off as a self-contained unit.  It is rather difficult to get at the zigzag components with the embroidery unit in place.  These machines are very prone to seizing, if you read the manual it tells you to occasionally unthread the machine, set the embroidery unit to certain settings, & run it for a few minutes if you don't use it regularly.    
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Miriam

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Reply with quote  #24 
I looked at that machine with Kathy. We were chicken to take off the embroidery unit. From the schematic it looked like there might be a screw in the front right but we weren't sure. I wasn't sure enough of what was involved. IMHO what seems seized is some kind of reader. The knobs turn, the things that turn turn fine, zz and ss beautifully. BUT it isn't doing the fancy stitches. I would assume there is some thing with a spring on it to read the camstack not returning. Then we saw what might be a cracked nylon gear I'm no expert on that either. I don't see a lot of Pfaffs. IMHO it would be a wonderful machine.
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phansen

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Reply with quote  #25 
Did you guys get any close ups? Zig zag and Straight stitch work but not embroidery. What is lever "E" set to. Try it on 3. also when turning lever "E" does it feel like it's moving anything inside. I wonder if its not engaging the embroidery unit. When you remove the top cover for oiling or inspection "E" should be set to 5-6. If the top cover is off the machine the embroidery unit will not engage. But ZZ and SS would still work. I could easily be wrong but I don't think lever "E" is engaging properly to turn on the embroidery unit.
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phansen

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Reply with quote  #26 
A side note can we keep the how-to forum for how-to's. Keep questions like this to the general forum.
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SteveH-VSS

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Reply with quote  #27 
I am going to move this thread out to the main section
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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #28 
Where is main section???
Now I sort of lost the continuity of this topic.
I took my Pfaff with me to Indy last week to work with Miriam. I had 2 manuals but we still seemed to not have enough adequate info. Also, we were not in "manual reading comprehension mode". I think some of these manuals can read like hieroglyphics. You read but it just does not make sense.
Today I printed another manual that seemed to be more what I was looking for.
Yesterday, I followed a suggestion to use carburetor cleaner and again cleaned and oiled the inside of the machine. I think I agree that I need to check the "engaging modus apparandum" for the embroidery mechanism. I want to try that before I attempt to remove the embroidery mechanism.
This is definitely a challenge. It would be really fun to have all those decorative stitches!!

Kathy
Near the WI/IL border

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SteveH-VSS

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Reply with quote  #29 
I should have typed "I have now moved this"...

It is here in the main "Victorian Sweatshop" section now.



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blkshfarm

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Reply with quote  #30 
I have been reading this thread and you said you were moving it to the main section. I have a question concerning a Pfaff 230-260. Where do I post it?
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SteveH-VSS

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Reply with quote  #31 
This is in the main section.   Post your question right here, or open a new topic, either works!
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blkshfarm

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Reply with quote  #32 
Thanks for your reply. I have a Pfaff 230 with the dial-a-stitch added. It was given to me. It was frozen up quite badly and I watched numerous videos on how to unfreeze it. I had good success unfreezing and oiling. I took the embroidery mechanism out and cleaned and oiled that as well. In testing out  the embroidery stitches, it seemed they were very narrow. I decided to turn the screw on the back that adjusts the width of the stitches. I turned the wrong one. I turned the screw that's actually on the outer housing of the machine rather than the screw that is inside of the casing thru a hole in the casing. Now that screw is loosely turning and can't tighten it. I have no idea what it's function is. I don't see any mention of it anywhere. This picture is of the area where the screw is. There is a set screw which when loosened doesn't seem to matter. Anyone have any ideas?

 
Attached Files
docx Pfaff copy of gear 230 with notations.docx (450.11 KB, 22 views)

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SteveH-VSS

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Reply with quote  #33 
here that is as a JP)G for ease of viewing Pfaff copy of gear 230 with notations.jpg 

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blkshfarm

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Reply with quote  #34 
Thank you. I have no idea if what I sent was view able or not.

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Ariel

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Reply with quote  #35 
I had the same problem with my 230 automatic with the decorative stitches not working; just straight and zig zag. I unscrewed the knurled knob and spring holding the cam stack and started wiggling it and discovered that the cam stack could be lifted off by pushing the spring- loaded numbered dial to the left and turning the cam stack until the flat portion cleared the dial, and sure enough there was just a touch of corrosion inside the cam stack "axle". A little oil and gentle wiggling back and forth lubed up the cam stack "axle" and the automatic decorative stitches works again. IMG_2892.jpg  IMG_2893.jpg  IMG_2895.jpg  IMG_2896.jpg  IMG_2897.jpg  IMG_2898.jpg 
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blkshfarm

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Reply with quote  #36 
Thanks for the  reply.  I  will  try that.

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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #37 
Thanks to everyone who posted information here, the pattern wheel is a great find.  Printed and laminated the parts and it works great.  I am having trouble downloading the manuals though.  Also does anyone have a service manual for the 360?  I have found operator manuals but no service/repair manuals.

Thanks again for the information.
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stitchntime

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Reply with quote  #38 
I have a pdf of the service manual, but it's over 10mb.  Not sure if I should post it here.  PM me.  Or let me know what you're trying to do with it and I can send you just those pages. 

Mine was frozen up pretty good when I got it, but patience, oil, and lots of "exercising" freed it up.  I've seen youtube videos of people that tried to repair/replace stuff that probably didn't need to be repaired, and they caused more damage.  I picked up the service manual intending to disassemble the zz control lever, but talked myself out of it.  I'm glad I did.

Greg
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ChattyKathy

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Reply with quote  #39 
There is a Pfaff IO group that has all the manuals available for downloading.
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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #40 
Thanks for the reply.  My machine works great, I just like having the repair manual in case something does go wrong.  I have been a mechanic and machinist so the repairs don't worry me. 
Forgive my ignorance but what is an IO group and where do I find them.

Thanks again!
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Phyllis1115

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Reply with quote  #41 
Thanks for the manual and service manuals and the video and photo posts. 
I have a few  of these machines and need to bring them back so I can use them.

Old Pfaff Pforum is now on IO. It was a Yahoo group. The website that I use is below. I am not sure how to join, because I was either grandfathered in or sent an invitation to join my groups.
Try this link. Search for OldPfaffPforum.

https://groups.io/search?p=SubsCount,,,20,2,0,0

The below link shows the topics section
https://groups.io/g/OldPfaffPforum/topics

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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #42 
Thanks Ill check it out.
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Olaf

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Reply with quote  #43 
You may download my collection of english manuals for the Pfaff 260-262-360-362, the numbers usually overlap in manuals. For the machines designated for an overseas market, like USA, Pfaff used a mix of Vaseline and Petroleum on the mechanical parts, for both lubrication and rust prevention. After some years it dries out and turn into something resembling epoxy glue! WD40 can be used as a solvent to free the mechanism, but should be removed afterwards, as it has no lubricating effect. BTW, Pfaff made a little confusion by introducing the 261 number to machines equipped with the automatic option, so a 362-261 is a machine with the automatic embroidery package, while the older 230 used 230-260 for the automatic.
You'll find a 362 user manual at https://www.manualslib.com

https://w123.no/pfaff-en/

Olaf

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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #44 
Thanks Olaf! Exactly what I was looking for.  Thanks again.
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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #45 
Hi all, not being able to leave the house due to the virus I have been able to spend some time with my 360.  That said I ended up having to fix the tension adjuster, again thanks to Olaf for the manuals, which I used. 

The question I have now is where is a good place to buy needles and the accessory feet?  

Thanks
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stitchntime

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Reply with quote  #46 
I have a 360 that I use regularly.  The needles are standard 15x1.  There doesn't seem to be that many parts available for these.  Your best bet for feet may be ebay.  I only have the standard foot for mine.

Happy hunting!

Greg
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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #47 
Thanks! It sounds like it will be a hunt.
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Olaf

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Reply with quote  #48 
Most low shank feet should fit the Pfaffs, borrow some for testing, before you buy. The original Pfaff feet may be difficult to find in USA.

https://www.sewmucheasier.com/will-presser-foot-fit-sewing-machine
At the same site you'll find A Quick Guide to Your Sewing Machine Presser Feet

You'll find some common parts here: https://www.sewingpartsonline.com/pfaff-362-sewing-machine-parts.aspx?sort.ss_cat_sort=desc&index=1

Olaf

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Pfaff 360

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Reply with quote  #49 
Thanks again Olaf your information is exceptional! I was curious about the Singer feet fitting they look very similar. 
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