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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #1 
Newbie here and my first post. I am searching for a bobbin winder for my Singer 1885 Improved Family. I just purchased a belt and I know the spindles are not in the correct holes. Someone decided to pound spindles into the wrong holes before I acquired the machine. I've gotten all but one of them out so far. Does anyone know if there are other models that are compatible with the Singer 15-1 Improved Family? I know it's a long-shot but I thought I would try to find one that is compatible with my machine. Also, has anyone seen a coffin cover like this one? I was wondering if someone made this cover or if it came with the machine originally. Any help is greatly appreciated!

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jpeg 20190223_073738 (2).jpg (384.03 KB, 21 views)
jpeg 20190223_074442.jpg (215.99 KB, 21 views)

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SteveH-VSS

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Reply with quote  #2 
Welcome!

Nice IF!!!

The 15-1 (IF) is a unique beast.  Some parts are interchangeable with later machines, others not so much.  It also depends on the specific variant of the IF you have.  This was a transitional machine for Singer and as such it went through a lot of small changes.

The cover certainly looks homemade to me.  It may just be the angle, but that deck has interesting proportions.  Please feel free t post more pics showing various areas like the head/face and back of the machine.  That, along with the serial number, can help us narrow down what you have.

I have two, one in a parlor cabinet, and one in a typical treadle unit.  Here is mine in a typical treadle.
Ebay Pic #2.jpg 

and with the cover
20190213_192835.jpg 


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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #3 
Hello rchappell, welcome to the group. I can say that the top is made out of wainscotting. It is nicely made and looks maybe 20'-40's based on the oxidization of the pine. I will send a picture of what the top should look like for a Singer IF made from 1879-1885. Here is a sales brochure for 1884 for reference https://www.flickr.com/photos/132113927@N03/29470787323/in/dateposted-public/ if that helps. I suggest keeping your eye out for an original domestic(will take a picture of that as well)

Your machine might be an industrial, semi industrial or domestic based on the decals alone. Is there an area on the right side under the handwheel that a part can be slotted into and bolted? The industrials and domestics are different. I also noticed you seem to have a weighted band wheel, which indicates light/med. industrial. I can't find my reference for the weighted wheel, but i think it might be part 7h from 1884 or '82 parts manual (Smithsonian archives).

Could i get a picture of the faceplate? There are over 32 different types of IF.

One modern solution is a item called a "sidewinder", i don't know how well they work for IF bobbins yet.

  John Stuart
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OurWorkbench

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Reply with quote  #4 
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnstuart
... I can't find my reference for the weighted wheel, but i think it might be part 7h from 1884 or '82 parts manual (Smithsonian archives)....


Are you referring to http://www.sil.si.edu/DigitalCollections/Trade-Literature/Sewing-Machines/NMAHTEX/1775/index.htm and/or http://www.sil.si.edu/DigitalCollections/Trade-Literature/Sewing-Machines/NMAHTEX/2725/index.htm ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnstuart
....One modern solution is a item called a "sidewinder", i don't know how well they work for IF bobbins yet.

  John Stuart


According to my calipers and my Sindwinder the main plastic part that the bobbin fits on is .205 inch or 6.15mm. rchappell thought the diameter of the hole is about 6mm so it could be close. I don't know if you have a Sidewinder, but the part the bobbin fits on is like a tube with a slit on the side that has a wire spring so bobbins with slight differences in diameter will work.

Janey

ETA rchappell, seeing SteveH's I.F. looks like the bobbin winder is attached to the belt guard, whereas, some of the pictures I have seen, it appears the bobbin winder is attached to the pillar. It looks like the manual from the 1891 found at https://www.singer.com/sites/default/files/product_manual/a1059f35cb57ddc4083d71b3325706157a0b06ae.pdf it is attached to the belt guard.

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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #5 
SteveH-VSS, that is a nice IF. I wish mine was in as good shape. I have just gingerly started to tear it down and start the cleaning process. The S/N is 6667878, so it was manufactured in 1885 I believe. OurWorkBench, I think the bobbin winder is supposed to attach exactly like SteveH's IF to the balance wheel/spindle. All the ones I have seen with the bobbin winder spool on the base of the machine have all been attached to the balance wheel. There are no holes drilled into the side of the pillar to attach a winder. I've attached more photos for reference. johnstuart, I have been wondering about the balance wheel also as I have not really found any that have that many spokes in them. It will be interesting to find out if this machine was for domestic or industrial use. 20190223_073955.jpg  20190303_164103.jpg  20190306_202420.jpg  20190223_074053.jpg 
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OurWorkbench

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Reply with quote  #6 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rchappell
... I have been wondering about the balance wheel also as I have not really found any that have that many spokes in them. ...


It looks like your balance wheel is like 2009 shown on page 21 of http://parts.singerco.com/IPpartCharts/15-1_11_22_30_41_43.pdf According to that pdf it was for the 15-1 and 15-11. Of course who knows what parts were changed out over the life of the machine.

Janey

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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #7 
Rchappell, the handwheel is correct for 1885, mine is the same here IMG_0476.jpg  This 1885 IF is a handcrank originally, in an unknown to me, case type. IMG_0067 (1).jpg  Above is the two top spool system, a possibility for your machine and bellow is the faceplate that goes with that system IMG_0069.jpg  Notice there is two thread guides near the top, most have one on the right side only.

The thing i noticed in one of your pictures is the drive wheel under the table. Here is my domestic one, not weighted IMG_0471.jpg  and a straight on picture at 90 Deg. IMG_0472.jpg  notice the sides don't puff out like yours seems to do. The one your machine has looks puffed out and is called a weighted wheel. These were used mostly on industrial and semi industrial like the "for all sorts of light manufacturing" in sales brochures found here in the 1884 sales brochure IMG_0130 (1).jpg 
Based on your photos this is what the bobbin winder should look like attached IMG_0473.jpg 
and un-attached IMG_0474.jpg 

  John Stuart

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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #8 
OurWorkbench and johnstuart, thank you for the additional information. I am wondering then if a bobbin winder for the 15-1 is the same as the 15-11. The close up photos do help ALOT. The side of my machine (the thread tension assembly) looks almost identical. Mine does have two thread guides. I'm not sure I see a difference in the drive wheel. The attached photos are yours on the left and mine on the right.  tension assembly.jpg  wheel.jpg 
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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #9 
The drive wheel is weighted on your machine. If you compare the groove for the belt to the surrounding metal, You will notice your machine has more metal on the sides of the wheel. The sides of my wheel are flat and your wheel is rounded.

I don't think the 15-11 winder would fit an Improved Family.

Hoping to have the sales brochure in PDF today for this model and some others.

  John Stuart
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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #10 
The pdf sales brochure for 1884 and 1866 will be late tonight/ tomorrow. I have noticed the face plate is different. The tension assembly isn't the same and requires a different faceplate. The adjustment for tension on mine has a front screw, i think your machine would have the side screw like this IMG_0218.jpg  You can see the adjustment screw slot just behind the disks. This is on a Singer Improved Manufacture.

  John Stuart

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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #11 
I have my machine cleaned up and she looks pretty good considering she is 133 years old, however, I cannot get a single stitch. I've checked my tension, re-threaded it, checked my bobbin, etc. and I can't see where the problem is. Anyone have any suggestions because I'm all out of ideas. 20190321_163344.jpg 
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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #12 
Might be it needs the light manufacturing needle like a 16x1 instead of regular 15x1. Is it just not down far enough on the needle bottom stroke to pick up the bobbin thread?

  John Stuart
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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #13 
I have adjusted that needle every which way but sideways. It does pick up the bobbin thread when I turn the wheel and then I can pull the bobbin thread up through the needle hole but once I start to sew it no longer picks up the thread. I will get some new needles and try that out because I've tried everything else.
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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #14 
Does it cut the bobbin thread, or it just doesn't pick it up when sewing?
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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #15 
Also , if you tilt it back does the hook look like it is late getting to the hoop in the thread?

  John
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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #16 
It doesn’t cut the thread. I was having a hard time seeing if the hook is not picking up the thread. I tried to see when the machine was off the base. I will have to go back and run through everything again I guess. I removed the plate, the feed dogs, and I still couldn’t see what the problem was.
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rchappell

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Reply with quote  #17 
Operator Error! I had the flat side of the needle shank positioned wrong. I put the flat side toward the back like I have on all machines I’ve ever used not realizing that the flat side goes to the right side. SHE SEWS!

[image001]

[image002]


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WI Lori

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Reply with quote  #18 
Congratulations!
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pgf

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Reply with quote  #19 
As I love to say, "I'll never make that mistake three times again!"
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My machines: http://projects.foxharp.net/sewing_machines/by-age
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johnstuart

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Reply with quote  #20 
I thought it sounded like a needle problem, just didn't think of that myself either lol. Great to hear it is working!! That is a nice machine.

  John Stuart
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